In this solo episode, Kurt talks about how to transform the culture in elders quorum and the entire ward by focusing on the heart of the men.


Research about men and suicide
Is Elders Quorum Working?
Warrior Heart Retreats
Cwic Show: The Problem with Men and Masculinity in the Church – feat. Kurt Francom
Thoughtful Faith: Are We as a Church Failing Men? (With Kurt Francom)
When the Bishop is Too Nice | An Interview with Dr. Robert Glover
How I Lead with Priesthood Blessings | An Interview With Mike Novakovich
One Couple’s Journey Through Sexual Addiction | An Interview with Chris & Autumn Bennett
Former Bishop, Recovering Addict | An Interview with Evan Hathaway
Wild at Heart
Waking the Dead: The Secret to a Heart Fully Alive
No More Mr. Nice Guy
The Alter Ego Effect
The Heart of Man (streaming)
Questions? Want to discuss this further with Kurt? Contact him here.
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2:40 Introduction to the episode’s topic: men at church

7:15 If we could crack the code with men to help them and strengthen them so that they can strengthen their own families. Turning to porn and other things for coping.

9:30 The media and social platforms attack masculinity and call it toxic. What does healthy masculinity look like? Does society know what to do with men? Does the Church know what to do with men?

11:50 When we unknowingly send the wrong message at church. Men hiding behind the perfect ironed suit and the huge smile. Unfortunately someone in the elders quorum is the most at risk of suicide.

14:00 How can we help men find brotherhood and connection at church? Kurt makes suggestions on things we can do. We need to offer more for men after they age out of Young Single Adult and mission programs.

17:20 If you want to fix the youth then walk down the hall and fix the elders quorum. Think of the impact that the elders quorum can have on the youth and their own children.

Toxic Masculinity, Passive Masculinity, and Healthy Masculinity on a spectrum

19:00 The nice guy vs. masculine man. Kurt dives into toxic masculinity and passive masculinity.

24:00 What does healthy masculinity look like?

27:45 What does the Church attempt to offer men? These are things that are offered on paper and with good intentions but sometimes seem more like assignments.

  • Saving ordinances
  • Spiritual development
  • Community and brotherhood
  • Service opportunities
  • Leadership opportunities

32:15 What do men need from the church? What do they need from their quorum? While it’s important to remind them of their duty and responsibility you have to start with a foundation. You have to start with heart.

34:00 There is no laziness in elders quorum, just a lack of fulfillment. How to help men turn back to their heart instead of duty.

39:50 According to author John Eldridge, every man has 3 core desires:

  • A battle to fight
  • An adventure to live
  • A beauty to love

43:40 How to stimulate brotherhood

  • We need to provide mentorship
  • Pray together and for each other
  • Invite people to share their story or share your own
  • Offer men adventure. Organize activities for men to get out

50:00 Kurt shares resources: books, events, podcast talks

54:00 How has ministering to men made you a better follower of Jesus Christ?

The Leading Saints Podcast is one of the top independent Latter-day Saints podcasts as part of nonprofit Leading Saints’ mission to help Latter-day Saints be better prepared to lead. Learn more and listen to any of the past episodes for free at

Past guests include Emily Belle Freeman, David Butler, Hank Smith, John Bytheway, Reyna and Elena Aburto, Liz Wiseman, Stephen M. R. Covey, Julie Beck, Brad Wilcox, Jody Moore, Tony Overbay, John H. Groberg, Elaine Dalton, Tad R. Callister, Lynn G. Robbins, J. Devn Cornish, Bonnie Oscarson, Dennis B. Neuenschwander, Anthony Sweat, John Hilton III, Barbara Morgan Gardner, Blair Hodges, Whitney Johnson, Ryan Gottfredson, Greg McKeown, Ganel-Lyn Condie, Michael Goodman, Wendy Ulrich, Richard Ostler, and many more in over 600 episodes.

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